This article, originally published by Al Zucaro on BocaWatch.org, is preserved for historical purposes by Massive Impressions Online Marketing in Boca Raton.
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Recently, Boca Raton was hit with a lawsuit because of its adoption of an ordinance that banned the practice of conversion therapy within the city. Although those who support conversion therapy will present the issue as an ongoing, science-based debate, this portrayal could not be further from the truth or reality. As reviewed below, there is absolutely no body of scientific evidence that supports the efficacy of these practices, and worse, it is likely they do incredible harm to those subjected, especially children (1). Supporters of conversion therapy will tell you that this is a First Amendment issue and that the practice is ultimately in defense of children. However, I will argue instead that supporters of conversion therapy do not care about children, but rather care about erasing anyone and anything that does not fit in their provincial worldview; they work not to protect children but to manipulate them and the broader public debate.
Let us begin by making one thing very clear: the debate over conversion therapy is not clinical but cultural. There is a reason that the only organizations that support conversion therapy are religiously based – there are no credible, scientifically based organizations that support it. Within the social and clinical sciences, this issue is analogous to global warming. While you can always find the one or two charlatans willing to deny the obvious, the vast majority of the field(s) is in consensus that conversion therapy is empirically and ethically problematic. More than a dozen national and professional organizations have denounced the practice (2). For example (full quotes available at the link below):
- American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry: “Based on the scientific evidence, the AACAP asserts that such “conversion therapies” lack scientific credibility and clinical utility. Additionally, there is evidence that such interventions are harmful.”
- American Counseling Association: “The belief that same-sex attraction and behavior is abnormal and in need of treatment is in opposition to the position taken by national mental health organizations, including ACA.”
- American Medical Association: “Our AMA: (c) opposes the use of ‘reparative’ or ‘conversion’ therapy that is based upon the assumption that homosexuality per se is a mental disorder or based upon the a priori assumption that the patient should change his/her homosexual orientation.”
- American Psychiatric Association: “Psychotherapeutic modalities to convert or ‘repair’ homosexuality are based on developmental theories whose scientific validity is questionable. The potential risks of reparative therapy are great, including depression, anxiety and self-destructive behavior, since therapist alignment with societal prejudices against homosexuality may reinforce self-hatred already experienced by the patient.”
- American Psychoanalytic Association: “Psychoanalytic technique does not encompass purposeful attempts to ‘convert,’ “repair,” change or shift an individual’s sexual orientation, gender identity or gender expression. Such directed efforts are against fundamental principles of psychoanalytic treatment and often result in substantial psychological pain by reinforcing damaging internalized attitudes.”
- American Psychological Association: “Be it further resolved that the APA concludes that there is insufficient evidence to support the use of psychological interventions to change sexual orientation; Be it further resolved that the APA advises parents, guardians, young people, and their families to avoid sexual orientation change efforts that portray homosexuality as a mental illness or developmental disorder and to seek psychotherapy, social support and educational services that provide accurate information on sexual orientation and sexuality, increase family and school support, and reduce rejection of sexual minority youth.”
Hiding behind the façade of their titles, these pseudoscientists and doctors can do incredible harm and perpetuate religiously based mythologies about the supposed pathology of being gay. 150 years ago, “scientists” used to measure lumps on people’s heads to determine their social characteristics – a ridiculous a long debunked practice called Phrenology. Conversion “therapists” are the Phrenologists of the 21st century. Calling conversion therapy “junk science” still gives it too much credit. Let us take a case example. A commonly cited study by supporters of conversion therapy is found in the work of Robert Spitzer, MD, who in 2003 published a “study” of 200 individuals having claimed to change their sexual orientation. Published without peer review, and following extensive criticism from experts, Dr. Spitzer himself negated the findings and issued an apology to both the scientific and gay communities some number of years later (3).
Having established the lack of scientific merit for conversion therapy, one must ask what the project of conversion therapy is really about. Some supporters will argue this is a First Amendment and freedom of speech issue. It seems especially ironic that a group of people apparently obsessed with notions of “liberty” cannot figure out how to get out of people’s pants. But if you really think this is a free speech issue, then consider these ordinances as time, place, and manner restrictions. You can still be hateful and terrible on your own time, but you must leave children out of it because the government has an express interest in protecting them as a vulnerable population. Further, there is absolutely nothing you can tell me to convince me that using “State’s Rights” to justify this is anything other than a politically expedient way to say, “gay people scare me but I know it is unpopular to say that.”
Going beyond medical efficacy and free speech, I am going to call this lawsuit out for what is it: an attempt to sow and perpetuate bigotry using the rhetoric of law, science, and medicine as a deceptive cloak. Rather than take the time to listen to and interact with someone who is different in an attempt to understand them, supporters of conversion therapy would rather devote their time and energy toward trying to change a fundamental part of someone else’s personhood. I can think of a lot of things to judge people about: narcissism, greed, envy, gluttony – things in no short supply here in South Florida – but being gay is not one of them. Perhaps supporters of conversion therapy should seek out their own help to better understand where their unsubstantiated prejudices come from.
(1) Drescher, Jack. 2015. “Can Sexual Orientation By Changed?” Journal of Gay and Lesbian Mental Health 19:84-93. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/19359705.2014.944460?journalCode=wglm20
(*Anyone who would like access to this article should feel free to contact me directly.)
(2) Human Rights Campaign. 2018. “Policy and Position Statements on Conversion Therapy.” https://www.hrc.org/resources/policy-and-position-statements-on-conversion-therapy
(3) Carey, Benedict. 2012. “Psychiatry Giant Sorry For Backing Gay ‘Cure’” The New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/19/health/dr-robert-l-spitzer-noted-psychiatrist-apologizes-for-study-on-gay-cure.html
Thank you Eric. I couldn’t agree with you more. I didn’t realize we were be sued for showing compassion and decency.
We have come to a point in our society where many people have a difficult time differentiating beliefs, and FACTS.
Converting someone from Homosexuality to hetrosexuality, makes as much sense as attempting to convert someone from Asian to Caucasian.
Or, converting someone from Caucasian, to Black (not you, Rachel Dolezal!).
It’s not a choice … like a crackpot, religious dogma.
It’s a scam.
THANK YOU ERIC!
THANK YOU ERIC!
First, I’d like to know the plaintiff’s name/names who are wasting our legal system’s precious time to promote this “witchcraft” with more litigious rubbish!
I wouldn’t be surprised with some fiery comments about my post. Frankly, I’m too exhausted by the continuing rhetoric from religious extremists and dictators to care.
Furthermore, as a gay American, who experienced this “Therapy”, personally, taking years to “recover”, I vehemently refuse to accept any claim that this treatment is “Free Speech.” It does nothing but harm, and to propose HARM to anyone is illegal. That’s why the city of Boca Raton, the county of Palm Beach and countless other locales have wisely and humanely chosen to make this theological sham illegal.
Could one, logically and sanely assume that, say the proponents of this treatment were correct, on the premise one’s sexual orientation can be “changed” , that a heterosexual person, with the reverse “therapy” could be converted to being a homosexual? Ludicrous right? I’m sure there will be those who think “Well, of course, because, being homosexual is AGAINST GOD”S WILL!”
My belief is “How arrogant for any human being to even flirt with “knowing” what God’s will is!”
Any man or woman who has claimed they were “changed” by this farce is in serious denial and emotionally dangerous, or worse, to any woman OR man with whom he/she attempts a relationship! The truth is like the sun, no matter how many clouds get in the way, eventually it will come out!
This “kool aid” is poison at best. They will not be leading authentic lives, preventing them from being the best of anything they could be if they lived life as their “Authentic self.” This treatment promotes duplicity, living double lives, brings children into the world via a lie, dupes and sets terrible examples.
It is a thief of time, especially for the individual in therapy and the people with whom they choose to attempt heterosexual relationships. Time is our most precious asset because nobody regardless of their monetary wealth can “make” more time!
Usually, the very people who claim their “God” has made us in “His/Her own image” are the same ones who criticize, reject, judge, bully, or worse, gay people. In effect, they are in fact, criticizing THEIR god!
Their god, made gay people who they are! Being gay is NOT a lifestyle. It is NOT a choice. Living in the country or on the beach, a condo or a single family home, is a “Lifestyle”. Let’s get THAT straight! Pardon the pun!
Let me be clear, are more than 25 million Americans that masochistic they would CHOOSE to be something that still, to this day, is subject to such loathing, invalidation, and judgement, just to name a few unpleasantries? Please, the ignorance is overwhelming.
That’s why I am personally alarmed, and anyone who is gay or loves someone who is gay should be offended that Councilman Jeremy Rodgers brings his religious views to our city government. What I mean is he voted “NO” for the city to adopt this law. One can see the vote on You tube.
There is an argument that it’s interfering with the parent-child relationship. It’s child abuse, and THAT is against the law. My perception is he advocates breaking a county and city law. Why would I support any government employee, AKA YOUR employee also, to remain in his/her position when it’s on record, they support breaking the law?
I am a very spiritual human being who believes in “Something greater than myself”. My behavior towards others reflects the “Golden Rule.”
I have grown very weary, and yes, leery of those who seem to think they have the “right” to impose their theological beliefs overtly and covertly on their fellow human beings by seeking to pass legislation influencing the lives of others with their religions convictions.
It’s my experience that these groups and individuals who scream and preach about protecting THEIR religious freedom the loudest, quoting the Constitution, are the same ones who seek to deprive people who believe differently, of those very same rights!
Mr Rodgers also seems to have difficulty keeping his religious comments from council meetings. I’m referring to the swearing in ceremony this April.
The people who founded our country were deists. They KNEW from the bloody history of religious wars genocides, where millions of people were butchered, shunned and tortured in the “Name of God” what ever the religion, that theocracy is NOT a democratic institution. So, that’s why they were so ardently in favor of keeping the church and state separate!
Sadly, still today, too much suffering and too many crimes are committed in the name of God.
This “therapy” is another crime.
Thanks again for exposing more about this and the people who continue to pursue torturing our children in the name of their god.
This “Conversion Therapy” is a diabolical, “snake oil” with horribly destructive, far reaching, short and long term repercussions too intricate to be fully described in this forum.
Thank you Anthony! Thank you Larry! You’re right on!
Eric, outstanding article. You are a breath of fresh air to boca.
I won’t comment on the pros and cons of conversion therapy because I don’t know enough about it to make an intelligent comment and I suspect that neither does the author of this article nor the individuals who have made these comments! I will, however, comment on the outrageous overreach of the Boca Raton government which, along with our State and Federal government, seeks to regulate all facets of our lives and to dictate their version of morality to us. If I was gay, that would be my business. If I wanted conversion therapy, that would also be my business and I’ll be damned if I want the “holier than thou” government meddling in MY business. The government (local, state, and federal) is welcome to collect taxes from me, protect me from enemies “foreign and domestic”, impose absolutely necessary regulations needed for my health and safety, and then get the hell out of my life! Additionally, as far as the comment the author made on climate change (or global warming or whatever), the only established fact is that, yes, the climate is changing. To then extrapolate that humans are the cause is ludicrous. I suspect that the author is sorely lacking on knowledge of this subject also.
Mr Jones,
If you read my comments, and paid attention, you would recall I was in “Conversion Therapy”, so sir, with all do respect, I DO KNOW QUITE ABIT ABOUT IT, AND MUCH MORE THAN YOU, contrary to your contribution to this thread. You, nor anyone else is NOT qualified, in any way to dispute my personal experience.
As far as the government’s over reach you are speaking of. I will agree that too often when the govt. should be involved, it isn’t and when it shouldn’t be it is. An excellent example is the State of Florida’s refusal to ban hand held cell phones while driving and to boot the cars of those who have been convicted of DUI.
You stated, you want the government to protect you from domestic and foreign entities that might do you harm. Well, there you have it again. In this case, the people, who elected the council members to be the government, are attempting to protect THE CHILDREN , who have little to say about their own lives, from those domestic entities who may harm THEM, INCLUDING THEIR PARENTS!
Would you please grace us with YOUR knowledge which intelligently disputes activities of human beings are NOT contributing to climate change?
THANK YOU VERY MUCH,
@michael A typical liberal/progressive point of view. You claim you have impeccable credentials and no one else is qualified to counter you. Sounds like Nazism or Communism to me. Unfortunately, from what you’ve said, I am pretty sure you will never submit your own beliefs to that same “high standard” you condemn others of not meeting.
Mr Fauteck,
Who claimed I have impeccable credentials? Sounds like YOU are the one giving them to me, not I.
Did I say, no one else was qualified to counter me?
I will continue to KNOW that no one can counter MY OWN EXPERIENCES. What I did experience BELONGS TO ME SIR, NOT YOU, NOR ANYONE ELSE because YOU are NOT ME! Someone may counter my opinion, not personal experience!
Do you personally know men and women who have lived double lives, because of crippling fear and crushing pressure from society to be who they ARE NOT, destroying the people they involve? Do you? I do!
Do you personally KNOW people under the age of 18 subjected to this “Therapy” who killed themselves? I DO!
Do you personally know, anyone who tried for decades to be something they KNEW they were not just to please someone else, wasting their life? I DO!
Do you personally know anyone, whose LAST prayer at night was to wake up “Normal” and FIRST thought in the morning was, “Oh my God, I’m still a Freak, unworthy of anything!”…ONLY because they were UNABLE to fall in love with a person of the opposite sex?
Do you personally know anyone who cut themselves with a razor blade 65 times and wrote a ” I HATE ME!” on their forehead with the razor blade ONLY because they still loved someone of the same sex, AFTER 6 months of this therapy!
I DO!
DO YOU PERSONALLY KNOW ANYONE WITH THOSE KIND OF EXPERIENCES?
KNOWING THESE COURAGEOUS PEOPLE with those experiences would never qualify me to know “everything”.
I don’t recall writing I did!
I would not attempt to arrogantly, as you have done, invalidate any personal experience which is yours either!
Please find a credible definition of Nazism and Communism before LABELING, and using those tired and expired escape goats for not knowing anything else to say!
How vast is your knowledge of each of those extremist institutions?
Please enlighten me enough to grasp you have an intelligent reason, based on critical thinking, to label my thoughts as you did!
I’m 64 years old.
Those, witch hunt, scare tactic, blanket labels were thrown around all the time in this country when I was growing up. Like I said, “Can’t you come up with something new?”
Anyway, they are polar opposites!
Oh, here we go again with the “Liberal/Progressive” name calling. Do people such as yourself have anything original to debase someone who doesn’t agree with your dogma? There are thousands of other words in Websters or Wikipedia at your disposal.
Wow, you’ve given me quite the collection of labels.
First I sounded like a Nazi and or a Communist. Now, according to YOU, I’m a Liberal and a Progressive!
Boy am I versatile or what! I have almost as many sides as a Rubix Cube!
Give me a break!
I have to laugh! Mr Fauteck, most of my beliefs are quite conservative, ( The traditional Conservative, NOT the current and convoluted definition).
I have to chuckle. You probably wouldn’t want to know what I think should be done with people who Text and Drive, Aggressive Drivers, murderers, and criminals in general. No, I don’t want to send them to Club Med for rehabilitation!
I’m more like Judge Judy than you can imagine. And, SHE, by far, is NOT “Your” “Liberal”
I am a registered Independent because my view is BOTH major parties are so myopically immature, they aren’t worth belonging to.
It’s so easy to label someone, for people with view points as yourself. It takes all the work out of really getting to know someone! Human beings are not a bottle of ketchup, where you read the label, and “Think” you know everything inside!
Go right ahead. Please! Put the beliefs you’re “Sure” I have and place them under a microscope! They are totally transparent.
I condemned no one.
I spoke of hypocrisy. I spoke of personal torture and abuse at the hands of someone else, Sir! Both are universally accepted as something WRONG!
If I felt you’d be someone I could have a debate with, I’d surely offer to YOU, submitting, and subjecting, “my” belief” to the “high standard” of which you speak!
But, because of YOUR, in fact, “condemnation” of my words, alas, now, I, am “Pretty Sure” your mind would be closed, as obviously your heart already is!
Thank you for making me even more resolute in feeling the way I do.
PS
I will NOT volley with you on this subject.
I absolutely agree with you, Stan – who has the right to DEMAND someone do as they want – I have nothing against or for the therapy, but I’m absolutely opposed to anyone/ especially government tell anyone what to do and what to think. This is liberals idea to go against anyone who doesn’t think like them. LIVE AND LET LIVE! If someone is a gay and DOESN’T LIKE IT and WANT TO TRY TO CHANGE IT it’s his damn business. I also would like to know what CHILDREN we’re talking about? How old are they? Children should think about the study, not about sexual orientation! But because our schools completely lost the dignity of the learning institutions, our children are brainwashed in all the wrong subject that shouldn’t bother them at all. What do you suggest, Michael? To take kids from their parents and give them to… who? Government? Or liberal organizations, maybe?
In regards to climate change, I will GRACE YOU with well-known facts – the KNOWN history of Earth.
Ms Zorin,
Why the profanity? Why the presumed anger against YOUR government?
You spoke of schools. Were YOU not taught at your school that it is rude to use profanities?
I would never agree for the govt to “take kids from parents” as you are exclaiming. Maybe where you were born this happened. That’s horrible to say the least.
Why, once again, the Liberal Label? YAWN! Do you KNOW what a “Liberal” supposedly is? For the record, it’s the rare bird who is 100% Liberal or Conservative. Maybe you are one. That’s not what we are speaking of, but I’m sick and tired of those words being the “end all” to describe someone.
Referring to what you wrote of Liberals, and what happens if someone disagrees with “them” , YOU seem to be doing exactly that!
I agree, I’d like to see our schools be more of place where learning manners, and practical life lessons are taught. I would welcome all public schools to require uniforms where students “compete” with their minds and not their the material things their parents give them! That would save parents a lot of money!
What subjects are the children being “Brainwashed” in?
I’m speaking of minor children, who do not have a “voice’ of their own. They cannot choose who they live with etc. They need protection. Abuse has many faces.
Ms Zorin,
If it wasn’t for the government you appear to be admonishing, in the not so distant past, YOU, ONLY because you are a woman wouldn’t have been able to vote. In many states, including our Florida, you wouldn’t have been able to own property by yourself unless inherited, work, have control over your own body, you could be FORCED to accept less pay than a man for doing the same job. AND, ALSO not long ago, until the GOVERNMENT PASSED LAWS PROTECTING YOU, there were many LEGAL ways to discriminate against you, for your religion, your ethnic background, your native language, where you came from, your age, marital status….for almost any reason, anyone felt like, and you wouldn’t have been able to do anything about how badly you were treated. That’s not to say those things still don’t happen. However, there are very strong laws protecting you..period. Too many, not all, of Your so called “Conservative” buddies today would call that “Big Government” as you described in your post. You apparently, from your comments, sound like that too. Hmmmmmm.
So…is it “Big Government” when it attempts to protect our children, as it protects YOU, from being subjected to something that harms them, even at their parents’ hands?
How old were YOU Ms Zorin the first time you had a “crush” on a boy? I’m assuming you are heterosexual. Human beings at a very young age know what attracts them. It isn’t always sexual, but it still is an attraction.
RE: Climate change. Yes, it’s always been there. That’s a main reason why dinosaurs became extinct. They weren’t flexible. MAN is contributing to this one! Is MAN flexible enough to accept what is happening and do what he can to not hasten or increase this current climate change? Or will he be a “dinosaur” because of arrogance and ignorance?
Do you know why a big city is often warmer than the suburbs? It’s the heat from cars, people, machinery, etc.
Do you know WHY it doesn’t rain as much in East Boca as it used to?
It’s called, HEAT. and heat, from parking lots with no trees, huge black building rooftops, etc, pushes clouds, away. Watch the birds “float” on the updrafts (thermals) from the heat.
Small planes often feel the ‘push” from heat caused by all the pavements, which, are mostly unshaded.
Add up the “HEAT” caused by 7 billion people, their animals, their machines, the concrete, the loss of forests and voila you have Man’s dark contribution to something that just might be naturally happening anyway.
Finally, in regards to BOTH the subjects mentioned. It is OK for me NOT to agree with people such as yourself. Tossing names and labels at me ie: anti- Christian, or anti-American, Liberal don’t help your argument.
I’m NOT a Liberal JUST because I disagree on these subjects, due to MY OWN EXPERIENCE MS ZORIN! That’s a very important point you did not pay attention to.
For the record, I don’t identify as a “Liberal” anyway. You’ll have to think of a more qualified reason not to like what I have to say.
It continues to amaze me that more hoopla was made, and still is, over some overpaid football players kneeling than the SCORES of children who have been murdered in our schools!
What about THEIR FREEDOM TO GO TO SCHOOL WITH NO FEAR?
Would you slap me with the “Liberal” label because I’m more upset over children being murdered than someone not saluting the flag? Would you?
Ask yourself the reason you came to the US?
Was it because you wanted everyone to think like you, or was it because you thought you’d be freer here to think and say what you wish without fear of being hated, hurt or worse? Or, God forbid, are you doing now to others here, what you feared of happening to YOU, from where you immigrated?
I don’t need your answer, but I believe YOU do, if you can be honest with yourself.
The “Freedom” so many people as yourself, claim as yours, also belongs to EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THIS COUNTRY whether they agree with you or not!
Yes, Ms Zorin, that is the Truth!
Boca Watch: Pls give us more details about the lawsuit. Was it by a profit based functionary who now feels unable to bilk the public via this law and thus has filed suit against the City. Details would be of interest.
I believe the answers you are looking for are contained here: https://www.mypalmbeachpost.com/news/crime–law/christian-group-sues-pbc-boca-over-bans-conversion-therapy/SsKHn5WTXKXB2ypsda8G8I/
The relevant parties seem to be a handful of plaintiffs from Boca and most importantly, the “Liberty Counsel.”
Stan “If I was gay” Jones: I don’t think if you really were gay, that you’d be upset at the lack of conversion therapy options in Boca Raton. Just a guess.
It’s the standard, anti-Christian, Left-Wing Jew POV.
MR JOY,
What is an “Anti Christian”, Left Wing Jew POV.
Hmmm, Jesus was a Jew.
What would Jesus think of YOUR comment?
Just a thought.
Jesus wouldn’t stop people from voluntary interactions. As far as “What is an Anti-Christian, Left-WIng Jew POV?” See the ACLU or the SPLC.
Dear Mr French,
You are absolutely right and I apologize. I did not completely read your post. If anyone knows about conversion therapy, it would be you. As far as protecting children goes, I will say, from personal experience, that many parents, rightly or wrongly, have submitted their children to this procedure out of fear for them. I am old enough to remember times when Gay people were not only discriminated against but routinely had violence perpetrated against them. Back then, parents were horrified at the thought of their child being subjected to to ridicule, discrimination, and violence that was the fate of most who were openly gay. Times have certainly changed but not all people. Finally, I did not say that humans do not contribute to climate change. Of course we do but in the grand scheme of things, I think you will find that our contributions are a drop in the bucket. The fact that climate is changing is established science. The amount that humans contribute to this change is still the subject of vigorous debate. If I could address Nick’s comment for a minute, no, I am not gay and I make no judgements about the conversion therapy because, as I said, I don’t know enough about it to comment intelligently. My fight is with government intervention where it doesn’t belong!
We don’t need a nanny government making decisions for us like communist dictators. The liberals want to control every aspect of your life. I will be voting against Zucaro and all his left-wing minions.
Daniel…Your vote is your vote….however, I am confused on what your reasoning is. I did not write the article; nor have I commented….BocaWatch is a community platform for voices within the community. You are welcome to interact on BocaWatch with your point of view on this or any other subject. Thank you for following BocaWatch. Al Zucaro, Publisher
@ AL I am very surprised at your comments here.
First, after I asked you about your view of this therapy at your kickoff rally on 6/18/18, you said you would have to research it. Yesterday, I noticed this article which states it was written on 6/21/18. A coincidence? If not, might you have encouraged this article to promote, or “test the waters” on, this topic?
I am deeply disappointed.
Richard: Not sure what you are disappointed about. BocaWatch is a community platform. Eric, the author, is a member of the community. He is expressing his opinion openly and comments are welcome. In fact,this topic has attracted considerable comment. Thank you for your point of view. I appreciate the participation. Al Zucaro, publisher.
Hey guys! Eric threw out a really great article here that people apparently have opinions about even though they may or may not align directly with Eric’s. What’s awesome is that we can have a conversation about it without being being blocked or reported, really get to practice some Free Speech. Share whatever opinion you want about it. If the points you’re able to make are more convincing, more credible then go for it!
Just because Al says “yeah you can publish that article here” which I’ve never heard otherwise, doesn’t mean he’s saying “This is what I as the authority dictate as the truth.” It only says “Here’s something you might want to pay attention to.” He thinks everyone needs to be paid attention to – that’s why your comments here weren’t censored or anything like that.
I’m actually disappointed nobody has made any salient points in defense of the right to Gay Conversion Therapy, but yet so many people have taken time to complain about the article. I can defend it in a manner that’s pro-gay and scientifically sound. That sounds completely contradictory right? But it isn’t. If you think about it long enough you can probably defend it in the same way, but I’ll leave that to you, the audience to arrive at on your own. Would I advocate for it? Not for what you think it’s for. But defending its right to exist is different. It’s not that high of a reach. Come on!
It is the City of Boca that is wasting our tax dollars passing laws that try to deprive citizens of their rights and freedoms. The same way they decided to waste our tax dollars by joining a lawsuit to restrict our 2nd amemendment rights. Why do people in government think they know what’s best for everyone else?
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU ALBERT on BOTH issues. Imagine that!
…and I’m disgusted with our local elected officials that are trying to usurp our state and federal laws and redefine truth.
Eric, your article doesn’t cite any “evidence” whatsoever. All you have is opinions from a bunch of left-wing organizations. The AMA is a joke. These are doctors who have profited handsomely from the opioid crisis, handing out pills like candy, and they take no responsibility whatsoever. Their opinion isn’t it worth the paper it’s written on.
So far we have heard about the adverse effect of this therapy on Children from Eric, the author of this article, who I assume has not been through conversion therapy, and Michael French who has been through the therapy. The only opinion I give any weight to is Michael’s. Obviously, he had a horrible experience and I sympathize with him. However, his case is one bad result we have heard about. Are there people out there who have had good results from this therapy? Can we hear from them? If there are people out there who have been helped by this therapy, then we have an on going debate on the subject, not a case of child abuse as is being portrayed. If, in fact, that is the case, then I reiterate that banning the therapy in Boca Raton is massive overreach by the city government.
Hello Stan,
First, thank you for your second response to my post! That speaks volumes about you!
You’re a good man, who at least doesn’t hurl all these labels around!
I appreciate your enlightened mind, not because you agree with me, but because you “gave” me the freedom to disagree with you. I am also thankful to you because you didn’t attempt to invalidate my personal experience.
For the record, I’m 64 years young, and I DO have decades of experience from where to pull my ideas and thoughts.
A minor doesn’t have the choice to go or not go for the therapy if his/her parents force them to. That’s the important part of this argument! FORCE. It’s like when they used to tie a kids left hand behind his/her back to “Stop” him/her from being left handed! The ancient Romans used to put left handed toddlers in the forest for the wolves to eat. Would you call that abuse? Yes, that’s an extreme case, but, it was their refusal, ignorance, etc that perpetuated these inhumane practices.
On this thread, I’ll refrain from a comment on your asking to know if someone has been “helped” by the therapy.
I’ll just give you an analogy. If there was a therapy to make left handed people, right handed, would you recommend it or would you propose “It’s not the norm, but it’s normal, because it’s not innately hurting the person.” People used to make fun of “South Paws” and there were some pretty nasty things, as I mentioned above, done to them to make them “change.”
Would you put a fresh water fish in a salt water tank because you wanted it to be a salt water fish? Simple analogy but poignant.
I get the point you made about parents being “afraid” their kid would have a rough life. I sure do. My parents were like that. I don’t blame them. I harbor no resentment towards them at all. It doesn’t undo the damage though.
Believe me Stan, NO BODY WANTED TO CHANGE MORE THAN ME!
IF people acknowledged that being gay is not the norm but “normal”, there’d be no need for the therapy, thus no need for these laws prohibiting it. The ONLY reason being gay “hurts” anyone or their life is rough is because of society, not innately because someone is gay!
For God’s sake can some of these people let go of the label hurling ie: “Left wing, Liberal” etc. Can ya be a bit more original and just maybe really “argue” the point instead of taking the lazy, easy way out of Labels?
Give the second amendment chatter and obsession a break! There are so many other more important things to get “angry” about! I used to have a cool pearl handle derringer, I took with me to make night deposits! I knew how to use and did! Now….THAT IS a story!
I have a question though. Why would anyone want to remain in a country, where you feel it’s so unsafe you must have a gun? How great could it really be? Seriously.
Do you choose to live in a city where the crime is high, or do you prefer to live where it’s safer? Is it safer because so many people have a gun? Wouldn’t you rather “fix” the reasons one has the need to have the gun?
If it’s the “beware of the government” reason, I have to laugh. Believe me, if they come for you, all the guns in the world won’t save you! Remember WACO? C’mon, get real!
Smith and Wesson are laughing all the way to the bank! They don’t give a rat’s A__ about you! They want you to buy MORE guns! Yep, pardner…that’s it!
RE: this penchant for admonishing the government.
Hey, until 3 years ago, the Government, with I suspect the approval of too many of you who have commented on this subject, SUPPORTED it’s law against letting people like ME have the same privileges as you regarding marrying the person you love!
Talk about big Government! Regulating your heart and personal life? How’s that as an example of “Big Government”? And, as I just wrote, I bet MOST of you admonishing the government supported that inhumane law!
Religion, WHICH we all are guaranteed freedom of, just like the second amendment, is the entity which is the judge and jury here! Take religion out of the equation, and there’s no differentiating between gay or straight.
So, if someone’s religion is OK with the “gay thing” they have the right to do so.
It doesn’t hurt YOU!
And….it doesn’t affect YOUR Marriage!
Heck, with over a 50% percent divorce rate, I’d say those who aren’t gay are doing a pretty good job “Threatening the “Sacred” institution of marriage” all by themselves! Talk about honoring your promises and commitments!
I will add, that ALL OF YOU AND THE PEOPLE YOU LOVE, have been PROTECTED by this government, IN SOME WAY OR FORM at some point! Yes you have!
From labor laws, like overtime, to criminal punishment, discrimination laws, Veterans benefits, etc we have all been protected by the government at one point. IS IT PERFECT? HECK NO!
Yes, Jason, Please encourage those who KNOW people who have had the therapy and have TRULY “changed” come forth! That would be GREAT! Find them please!!!!
HAVE A GREAT NIGHT AND HAPPY JULY FOURTH TO EVERYONE!
THANKS AGAIN STAN!